David Thompson
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February 14, 2007

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Brendan_2

I thought to return to the 'behemoth' and post the recent article by Pascal Bruckner attacking Ian Buruma and T.A. Ash, but thought better of it. Not that I believe there is no defense to at least some of his charges, but this damning quote in particular deserves repeating in support of this article and arguments :)

...This vicious mechanism is well known. Those who revolt against barbarism are themselves accused of being barbarians. In politics as in philosophy, the equals sign is always an abdication. If thinking involves weighing one's words to name the world well, drawing comparisons in other words, then levelling distinctions testifies to intellectual bankruptcy. Shouting CRS = SS as in May '68, making Bush = Bin Laden or equating Voltaire to Savonarola is giving cheap satisfaction to questionable approximations..

David Thompson

Brendan,

Thanks for the quote. I’ve been following some of the exchange over at B&W. And, for all our sakes, let The Behemoth lie.

I suppose “naming the world” is a big part of what I’m getting at. For instance, I’d like to see the word “primitive” return to considered use. It’s a perfectly good word. Likewise, the phrases “superstitious claptrap” and “sanctimonious phoney” shouldn’t be beyond the pale when debating with certain religious spokespeople. I don’t think one need start any debate with those terms, but they should remain part of the arsenal and be deployed as and when necessary.

But maybe that’s just me.

Meccano

Fascist Islamaphobes may your wives be infected with the camel's ear parasite and they become barren. How dare you insult Sheik Yusuf al-Qaradawi of course he is correct that in Islam it is admissible to beat the woman but we never touch the face, for this would be haram. We administer punishment according to the holy scriptures and we do it with love. As you say " it hurts us more than it hurts you".

The Guardian’s Madeleine Bunting is a beautiful woman but with her hair on display and her lips having make up gives me unnatural desires. Far better if she would cover up this indecency like Yvonne Ridley - she lovely Islamic lady.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/insideout/northeast/series4/i/ridley200.jpg

Brendan_2

[We administer punishment according to the holy scriptures and we do it with love. As you say " it hurts us more than it hurts you".]

Heh, now that's one for all time. Tell me hierophant, when --and where-- do muslim women get to beat their men? One can only presume that your "unnatural desires" deserve a good sound--but loving--beating.

Meccano

Oh Brendan dear Brendan
don't worry unnecessarily we only admonish under strict guidelines - relax we are a peaceful and just people, for example one of our scholars Muhammad Kamal Mustafa "recommends verbal correction followed by a period of sexual abstinence as the best punishment for a wife, but does not rule out a beating as long as it is kept within strict guidelines... to avoid serious damage, a husband should never hit his wife in a state of extreme or blind anger. He should never hit sensitive parts of the body such as the face, head, breasts or stomach. He should only hit the hands or feet using a rod that is thin and light so that it does not leave scars or bruises on the body. The husband's aim, should be to cause psychological suffering and not to humiliate or physically abuse his wife.

You see Brendan we are very civilized, unlike you Europeans who just think of women as sexy objects. I assume you are European with a name like Brendan (Irish? perhaps) maybe you could choose nicer Islamic name when you convert (by choice there is no compulsion in Islam) How about Ali or Mubarak? Keep your silly Irish name if you must, but you will have to pay the poll tax if you are to remain a kuffir. Al hum dil il Allah

Brendan_2

Well, hierophant, I'm no dhimmi or dummy for that matter. Your silly superstitions are all well and good in the less educated parts of the world, I suppose, until we can educate them of course. Here, we are all equals chum, and I chide you as I would chide my brother for his silly or regressive habits. I would of course lovingly beat my brother until he relented his religious deference to a supernatural deity and accepted rational thought and, of course, equality of the sexes. You should be proud of human accomplishment, particularly in the 'west', as we send our women into space… while you islamists do not beat them on the face. Do you see the lack of equivalence in that, pray tell?

Meccano

Dear dear Brendan
you say you are no Dhimmi by that I assume you no longer are an infidel and have embraced the superior faith of Islam. Any one who does not accept the fact that the one and only true god is Allah and Mohamed is his messenger is a Dhimmi "Here we are equals chum" what nonsense you will never be my equal until you embrace the truth and as is writen in the holy book men are above women

[4:34] The men are made responsible for the women, and GOD has endowed them with certain qualities, and made them the bread earners. The righteous women will cheerfully accept this arrangement, since it is GOD's commandment, and honor their husbands during their absence. If you experience rebellion from the women, you shall first talk to them, then (you may use negative incentives like) deserting them in bed, then you may (as a last alternative) beat them. If they obey you, you are not permitted to transgress against them. GOD is Most High, Supreme.

You see infidel we only beat them when they disobey.
Obey us and everything is fine.....Allah u akbhar

Meccano

Resistance is futile
You will be assimilated!

Brendan_2

Hierophant,

You, and your superstitious religion, are anachronisms, a hangover from the previous age. To trot out your supremacist leanings based on such 'revelations' is embarrassing to us all and will serve only to speed the demise of the entire paradigm that supports muslim foolishness. Assimilated? Only to subvert my brother.

Will Ness

"Resistance is futile
You will be assimilated!"

This is great Start Treck quote! Greatly enjoyed. :-) Thanks for the hillari-ous put-on!

On a serious side, the key to moral relativism seems to be "committing to none of the values in question". Which means, we have to choose our culture, and we have the right to make our choice. We are not some kind of angelic super beings pretending to coldly judge any and all culture, infallible, as postmodernists pretend to be. Rather, we are moral creatures, and as such are entitled to, and responsible, for choices we make, be it to serve as a useful idiot for the Army of Islamic Imperialism, or to stand guard for values of Reason and Freedom of Thought.

georgesdelatour

You're being referred to over at this blog -
http://imomus.livejournal.com/265541.html?page=2

You may wish to defend yourself...!

David Thompson

Georges,

Thanks for the heads up, but I don't see much need. None of the points I've made have been addressed in any way, let alone refuted. Though bearing in mind my offending articles criticise xenophobia and suggest that women shouldn't be beaten in the name of God, it's a little odd to then be dismissed as "a good old-fashioned xenophobic right winger."

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