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David Thompson
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April 19, 2012

Comments

rv

Right wingers always say fuck the poor.

Fuck you.

David

rv,

So far as I can make out, none of the authors quoted want to do away with the social safety net. Or, as you put it, “fuck the poor.” They do, however, seem keen to widen the debate about poverty to include some rather pertinent factors. Say, the extent to which some poor people are fucking their own life chances, and those of others. If a great deal of poverty is needless and self-inflicted, and is an issue of culture and behaviour, isn’t it a good idea to highlight the problem in a realistic light? Or do you think that’s wicked?

“Fuck you.”

Ow, my feelings.

AMB

rv,

Accusations of bad faith, even implicit ones, are the hallmark of moral cripples. Believe it or not, your ideological opponents (yes, even "right wingers") want what is best for the poor. This discussion of the fact that their poverty is at least in part their own fault, is part of the project of understanding why they're poor, which can help us figure out how best society can help them get out of poverty.

As David said, if a great deal of poverty is self-inflicted and completely avoidable, it behooves us to figure out ways to help people avoid it.

JuliaM

Sadly (having just had a conversation with a couple of people on Twitter over this), all discussions seem to boil down to 'You monster! You'd let children starve for the 'sins' of their parents!'

While the children are used as an impenetrable human shield, and provide shelter for the feckless parents, it seems we will always have more and more children born to poverty. How to resolve this?

Peter Risdon

I would have thanked you for the link, David, but it has led to my downfall, cooly and logically dissected by rv.

Anna

Ow, my feelings.

Has anyone else noticed how rv is always in a bad mood...?

Ted S., Catskill Mtns., NY, USA

Italian man burns art because we haven't been forced to pay for it; tells us it's our own fault

Gotta love the sense of entitlement and projection there. And of course, the 800-pound elepant media organization with the government imprimatur is sympathetic

There's a part of me that would love to get an arts subsidy and use it to make pro-Nazi art just to watch the Guardian types go nuts.

Anna

Italian man burns art because we haven't been forced to pay for it; tells us it's our own fault

At least it'll save on storage costs.

AC1

Seems to me that rewarding the results of sexual activity seems to be akin to making parents ransom their own children...

Namely "Pay up, or the child gets harmed!". I would remind people that paying the danegeld doesn't get rid of the Dane.

David

Further to rv’s umbrage…

The thing is, if a person wants to ensure a safety net for genuine misfortune and need, as I’d imagine most here do, shouldn’t they also want to consider the unnecessary and avoidable demands being made of that safety net? There is, after all, only so much funding and so much goodwill. Incidents like this one, and this, and this, and this don’t exactly help the future of the provision or bolster support for it. Isn’t the whole safety net put at risk, or at least put under great pressure and brought into disrepute, by rewarding irresponsibility and encouraging misuse?

Sam Duncan

rv: That's the best you've got? Someone says the poor need help, not paying off, and that's all you can come up with?

I've said it for a long time: the Left is so self-absorbed, so certain of its own goodness, that Leftists simply can't understand anyone else's point of view. Their way is axiomatically moral, so everyone else must be evil.

We understand them: Leftists think that all you need to do to alleviate the hardship of poverty is to take money from those who have it and give it to those who don't. We, going on an ever-growing mountain of evidence, simply disagree: that doesn't work. That's all. It doesn't work. It creates dependency, destroying self-reliance; it infantilizes, trapping people in a state of handout-leavened poverty, instead of helping them escape it to become - at least relatively - rich.

To judge from what we've seen of their policies in action over the last century, it seems to me far more likely that it's the Left who hate the poor.

AC1

The left LOVE the poor. Nothing makes more poor people than Marxism.

Lovernios

rv,

Fuck the poor, poor, pitiful poor. They're vulgar, crude, rude, ignorant, lazy and proud of it. I know this first hand having spent my formative years (prior to joining the military) living it. My parents did everything they could to drive the family into poverty: lack of education, alcoholism, eight kids, spotty employment and eventually welfare for over 20 years. With two following generations trailing behind.

Did I also mention, loud, obnoxious, greedy, quick to anger, violent and completely lacking in humility?

There you go.

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