David Thompson
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September 29, 2017

Comments

Hal

Twist.

I quite agree with the comments. The hipster costuming is, redundantly, ghastly.

PiperPaul

"turn the bloody phone round"

I don't know why phone manufacturers don't turn the damn lens 90 degrees. How many times do you actually want to take a photo in portrait orientation?

Hal

This too.

The chair moves to table the discussion.

Hal

And finally, zombie cheerleaders, ladies with “manipulative cleavage” and other casting calls of note.

Werewolf Paradise

dicentra

Redneck lawn chairs: https://twitter.com/YouHadOneJ0B/status/913599464241106944

Darleen
"Is the media complicit with all of this, or do they just suck at their jobs?"

Both

Pogonip

Those hair animations are creepy.

Patrick Brown

:

John D

Scenes from a small planet called Earth,

Stunning.

Sam

Your self-driving Mercedes.

That's not the Mercedes I had in mind.

David

“Is the media complicit with all of this, or do they just suck at their jobs?”

As you say, both.

David
Fuck your laws.

Via dicentra.

Joan

“Fuck your laws.”

I don't think they're sending their best.

David

I don’t think they're sending their best.

Added that one to the main post.

sH2

“Fuck your laws.”

"How the f*ck do you know that I'm brown?" ⊙_ʘ

David

I don’t think they're sending their best.

There’s a longer video of the altercation here. The last few seconds may amuse.

The young, um, lady in the video is Edith Macias, a student at the University of California, Riverside, where her brain is being enlarged with a course in Ethnic Studies. To recap, Ms Macias disdains the US as a terrible place to live, a place she “hates”; she disdains its laws, mocks the idea of property, feels entitled to theft and proudly uploads footage of the theft on Facebook with the hashtag #SnatchAHat to encourage others; she is openly and repeatedly racist; claims that words are “violence” and that hats cause “genocide”; and she’s mystified by how someone looking right at her could determine the colour of her skin.

So, a budding intellectual.

And remember, Ms Macias, steeped as she is in impervious morony, is the ideal end product of an Angry Studies degree.

Alice

The last few seconds may amuse.

They did. :-)

David

They did. :-)

You can practically see the predestined trajectory of it. She behaves in an arrogant and gratuitously antisocial way, steals someone’s property, threatens to burn it and insults the owner, while expecting to be seen as the victim, then causes a preposterous scene thereby wasting everyone’s time, makes a barely-veiled threat of physical violence, and when the campus police arrive she’s outraged. Presumably, the arrival of the police and the fact that she was eventually obliged to return the stolen property will be seized on as proof of her oppression in a “genocidal” wasteland of “white supremacy.”

The odds of Ms Macias reflecting on her own behaviour and assumptions, and how they result in the dramas of her life, seem vanishingly slim.

Rafi

“Fuck your laws.”

1. Rants about imaginary genocide.
2. Says "we'll have to get rid of y'all (white people)".

R. Sherman

The odds of Ms Macias reflecting on her own behaviour and assumptions, and how they result in the dramas of her life, seem vanishingly slim.

Sadly, she undoubtedly has already added this incident as a bullet point on her C.V.

Ted S., Catskill Mtns., NY, USA

“Fuck your laws.”

And then she goes on to tell him what his racial identity is and that he has to have the one she decides for him.

The idea that one person has the authority to control another's identity is profoundly evil. And of course, these are the people who claim to be tolerant and loving.

Min

“Fuck your laws.”

Ghetto trash gonna ghetto.

David

1. Rants about imaginary genocide.
2. Says “we’ll have to get rid of y’all (white people)”.

And then of course there’s the collective impotence of the staff, who listen to Ms Macias’ hysterical racial diatribe, indulging it, before eventually resorting to an effete pantomime of ‘let’s all talk about our feelings.’ As if elevating feelings, any feelings, to the status of proof weren’t a cause of, and enabling of, Ms Macias’ psychodrama.

Tim Newman

"Fuck your laws,” says she

She probably doesn't realise that it is only the decency of the man she stole from, and others like him, that is keeping her alive. In many societies, particularly historical ones, she would either have been beaten to a pulp, killed, or the man responsible with her forced to intervene and fight for his life to save hers. The way things are going, she might not have that guarantee much longer and historians will look back and think the last 50 years were an awfully quaint aberration.

Tim Newman

And then of course there’s the collective impotence of the staff

Yes. One of the nice things (which did have a sometimes horrific flipside, mind) of living in less enlightened places such as Russia, Thailand, and Nigeria is you didn't have to see any of this nonsense.

Farnsworth M Muldoon

Heh.

(N.B., Boston Antifa is an Antifa parody...)

David

The way things are going, she might not have that guarantee much longer

Ms Macias and those like her, and the so-called educators who actively encourage them and give them excuses to regurgitate, are, I think, exploiting the patience and restraint of the people they abuse. Perhaps they should bear in mind that patience and restraint can be exhausted, quite abruptly.

Tim Newman

Perhaps they should bear in mind that patience and restraint can be exhausted, quite abruptly.

That, and the fact that the people she's yelling at really are exceptions. Do you think the menfolk who make up what passes for her family would let her speak to them like that? I very much doubt it.

David

Meanwhile, in lighter news.

Via Obnoxio.

R. Sherman

Perhaps they should bear in mind that patience and restraint can be exhausted, quite abruptly.

It would seem that those who wish to abolish all of the various social conventions which allow us to coexist relatively peacefully are no longer content to engage in a "Long March." Of late, it appears they they are doubling and tripling down on their provocations, whether it's Antifa beating random people who are judged for having the wrong hairstyle, the NFL deciding to become a political organization at the expense of its customer base's sensibilities or any of hundreds of other slings and arrows. Are they really that imprisoned in their own Leftist bubble to think that this will end well for them?

Tim Newman

Are they really that imprisoned in their own Leftist bubble to think that this will end well for them?

I blogged recently at my place regarding an American Muslim woman who went on Australian national TV and said:

I think the problem is that people are voting for Trump in the first place. You know, I think THAT’S the problem that we have to address here, not the way that we choose to respond to that. If anything, we should make it so that there’s zero tolerance for those kind of attitudes to exist within our society. There’s no room for that type of intolerance. I mean, look at what happened, right? We started giving Trump air time in the media and giving him an opportunity to present his racist ideologies as a position on a policy platform.

It resulted in him actually getting elected. And now it resulted in white supremacist rallies in the streets, Neo-Nazis going like this again. You know, we really just regressed several generations backward. All this hard work for us to get to this point to make it unacceptable to be racist? Now it’s out in the open again.

Muslims make up 0.9% of the US population. That’s a rounding error. If I held such a minority status somewhere, I’m not sure I’d be on a national television saying the majority should be banned from speaking their minds. I think I'd be shutting the fuck up and praying the majority maintain their tolerance.

Darleen

The last few seconds may amuse.

Indeed.

Gotta love the bit about how she has to deal with "microaggressions" daily but he's "allowed" to wear the hat ...

What a finely-trained Leftist seal, she is. Hand her another fish.

David

It’s perhaps worth bearing in mind that Angry Studies, where most of the seething and hysteria are concentrated, tends to attract students with the lowest SAT scores, many of whom are beneficiaries of racial favouritism in admissions and wouldn’t otherwise be considered ideal candidates for tertiary education. They also tend to be middle-class, rather than bright kids from poor backgrounds, not that this prevents them invoking racial victimhood, often and loudly, even while being cossetted to a degree that few of us will experience.

It occurs to me that a mentally ungifted person surrounded by much smarter people – people who will probably go on to be successful in their fields, fields that are more rigorous and statusful, and earn a lot more – may feel some resentment. Conveniently, Angry Studies offers endless excuses for such feelings, and indeed is premised on cultivating them, whether justified or not, and offers a pretext to indulge almost any resentment, however petty and vindictive, in the guise of ‘activism’.

R. Sherman

@Tim Newman

These people, such as Amani Al-Khatahtbeh, live in a caricature of their own making. It is either a delusion upon which they maintain a death grip in order to preserve some semblance of lucidity or it's a callous play for power. (My vote is the latter.)

In the meantime, there is the rest of us. In the last couple of weeks, my youngest's high school soccer team has played opponents whose squads consist of mostly a) children of Bosnian immigrants and b) children of Mexican meat-packing workers. They were good games. Different styles of play, but very competitive. Multiple languages were spoken. Nachos were consumed.

Surprisingly, no one was screaming for deportations. No one was insulting each other. There was much commiserating among the parents about our state's upcoming high school championships and our respective teams' chances. In short, it was extraordinarily pleasant. And all this, in a state which went for Trump in November 2016.

I'd like to think that the professional agitators would not have a receptive audience among the fans that those games, but sadly those agitators seem to be consuming all the oxygen in the room of late.

WTP

Are they really that imprisoned in their own Leftist bubble to think that this will end well for them?

Their bubble is getting bigger, ours is getting smaller. Of course it won't end well, true. But how much damage will be done before things turn around? What disturbed me about the video was why the guy didn't just grab his hat back from the woman. It was HIS hat. Obviously wasn't hers by the very nature of the argument. Judging from the angle of the video, I'm guessing the guy (assuming his gender) is bigger than her. Why is he afraid to take back his property which she, by act of force, had already taken from him? Why do the cops have to get involved at all? The whole thing is a crap fest of stupidity.

Tim Newman

Why is he afraid to take back his property which she, by act of force, had already taken from him?

Because she'd claim assault, a mob would form demanding his lynching, and the spineless police and administrators would take her side because it's the easier course of action. She knows he'd not dare touch her. Like I said, if she'd done this on the streets of Lagos she'd be lying on the floor with a broken jaw.

WTP

Because she'd claim assault, a mob would form demanding his lynching, and the spineless police and administrators would take her side because it's the easier course of action.

She assaulted him by taking his hat. If they were still in whatever stupid "conference" they were in at the time she took it, I could understand the fear of the mob. But in the context of where the video was taken, those milquetoast administrators or whatever they were were incapable of doing anything. Especially once the situation had been explained to them. It's the BS of who is winning, who is in control. It's the BS of "all fighting is wrong". It's the BS that people do not have an inherent right to defend themselves and their personal property.

pst314

"Fuck your laws," says she

Every day more people start thinking that it is a serious mistake to tolerate leftists.

pst314

Because she'd claim assault, a mob would form demanding his lynching, and the spineless police and administrators would take her side because it's the easier course of action.

And because so many of them are on her side.
This illustrates why a society should be intolerant not only of militant leftists, but also of so-called peaceful ones.

[+]

“I fucking hate this country… and I am not leaving… We need to get rid of all ya'll”

If a white student said this he'd be expelled.

David

If a white student said this he’d be expelled.

It does seem possible, certainly. And yet Ms Macias is the one accusing others of “privilege,” specifically “white privilege,” which seems grimly ironic, all things considered.

If another example is needed, it’s hard to imagine a white student with white supremacist tendencies and a long criminal history not being expelled after repeatedly spraying deranged racist graffiti all over campus property, causing thousands of dollars of damage, and after threatening to kill anyone who tried to intervene. It’s also unlikely that such behaviour, by a white student, would result in lecturers abandoning their classes to “stand in solidarity” with him, and while demanding that “mental health support services” be made available to all white students, who, as a result of his arrest, were supposedly suffering from “post-traumatic stress syndrome.”

And yet.

Hal

Apparently there is a proposed new variation when ordering cakes from bakeries.

Daniel Ream

In many societies, particularly historical ones

In many societies, particularly historical ones, this behaviour would have been corrected long before getting to this point.

This is an emotional child, throwing a temper tantrum because no one has ever given her a time out. Like such a child, she's just pushing boundaries to see what she can get away with. What she needs is less coddling and a little more "Ma'am, if you don't return this man's hat immediately and apologize, we're going to charge you with theft and common assault."

Richard Cranium

"Apparently there is a proposed new variation when ordering cakes from bakeries."

@Hal, I (admittedly perhaps alone in this) view people who provide google search links instead of the exact link that was being read when the author posted his/her/its thoughts as a defecation orifice.

I'm not going to click on your version of "let me google this for you" especially since google has an idea of the things for which I search versus the stuff for which you search.

If you have a point due to reading something, post the link to the something versus a search string that may or may not lead to the something.

QuintAmpersandJessel

Cry rooms and empathy tents? These people are fucked up beyond help.

Hal

I (admittedly perhaps alone in this)

The overall story is all throughout the result(s) . . . and thus the advantage is that one can indeed see for oneself what the current commentary is . . .

JuliaM

'Art':

https://www.facebook.com/ZDuttaArt/posts/858385954327657

*shudders*

Richard Cranium

The overall story is all throughout the result(s) . . . and thus the advantage is that one can indeed see for oneself what the current commentary is . . .

No, that merely provides what Google deigns to tell one what Google believes one should see on the matter.

If you are what is considered to be "Conservative" in California, I'm not surprised to see you assert such a thing.

In what way, exactly, do you believe yourself to *be* conservative? That you're in the center of some two extremes?

Mike

The odds of Ms Macias reflecting on her own behaviour and assumptions, and how they result in the dramas of her life, seem vanishingly slim.

That.

David

That.

It’s difficult to picture a modern university encouraging any thought along those lines. It would be a heresy, an affront to “social justice.” More to the point, it would undermine the premise of the Angry Studies racket, to which thousands of paying morons are attracted, and vast swathes of “diversity” bureaucracy, where other morons are employed.

But if you wanted to encourage disaffection and antisocial behaviour, and criminal behaviour, along with irresponsibility and a life of resentment and failure, a good way to go about it would be to exempt people from the normal consequences of that behaviour, repeatedly, as in the case of Mr Denzel McDonald, linked above, and to generally cultivate a childish sense of entitlement.

Sound familiar?

dicentra

Steven Crowder's producer infiltrates Antifa, producing results that surprise no one here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmNz2jGzsDA

Kind of erases all doubt that there's an underground river that conveys the proper messaging to all media outlets and their talking heads, and that they've been told both to defend Antifa and to not look too closely at their structure and support systems.

The MSM is not just biased: they're actively organized like a mafioso family.

Trevor

Anyone know the Spanish for 'Lordy, nobody knows the trouble I've seen'? Apparently Ms Edith Macias was 'evicted of [sic] her apartment by a racist white bitch', leaving her with no alternative but to swallow her immense Latinx pride and beg on GoFundMe for contributions towards a deposit on a new gaff. A previous appeal by her on the site suggests that sub-optimal literacy is the rule rather than exception, hence my shocked face.

pst314

Seems like Edith Macias is quite the genius: She was arrested 3-1/2 years ago for causing an accident while DUI and fleeing the accident:
http://www.dailybulletin.com/2014/01/26/montclair-woman-held-after-upland-crash-causes-outage/
"January 26, 2014 at 11:54 pm UPLAND >> A Montclair woman is lucky to be alive after her SUV crashed through two power poles early Sunday morning, causing thousands to lose power, authorities said...The driver ran from the scene of the accident and hid in bushes about a quarter-mile away, where police found her...police arrested the woman, identified as 21-year-old Edith Macias, on suspicion of DUI and hit-and-run, Simpson said."

I'm sure it was da white man's fault that she got drunk and crashed her car.

R. Sherman

Now that Ms. Macias has made a name for herself and people are beginning to dig up her history--the internet is forever--we can expect all manner of outrage at the violation of her "privacy" and unfairness of dredging up her old sins in a blatant attempt to distract us from the righteousness of her Latinx struggle and oppression by "The Man" peddling white supremacist ideology. Karma's a bitch, ain't it?

Darleen

: She was arrested 3-1/2 years ago for causing an accident while DUI and fleeing the accident:

Ah, my office handled her case - good lord, she got a ton of continuances and finally plead in Jan 2016.

https://portal.sb-court.org/Portal/Home/WorkspaceMode?p=0

(I note she is STILL paying her fines to the court)

Darleen

Oops... I just realized that link might not get to her actual case (I hate our court's Odyssey Portal system - POS/PIA)

Her case number is TWV1400661

Go here and do the Smart Search - https://portal.sb-court.org/Portal/

David

Apparently Ms Edith Macias was ‘evicted of [sic] her apartment by a racist white bitch’,

Ms Macias seems keen to denounce others as racist – it’s her go-to position. And yet the only racism we hear falls out of her own mouth, loudly and often. Along with repeated threats of violence, both muttered and in writing, e.g., “Youre [sic] not safe... just saying.” Perhaps that has some bearing on why landlords may be reluctant to have her as a tenant.

The driver ran from the scene of the accident and hid in bushes about a quarter-mile away, where police found her... police arrested the woman, identified as 21-year-old Edith Macias, on suspicion of DUI and hit-and-run,

An inspiration to us all. Again, the odds of Ms Macias reflecting on her own behaviour and assumptions, and how they result in the dramas of her life, seem vanishingly slim.

What a finely-trained Leftist seal, she is. Hand her another fish.

That. It’s remarkable how so many of these creatures, seen in dozens of videos over the last decade, have eerily uniform postures and responses. As if they were incapable of autonomous mental activity, but had been handed half a dozen excuses to memorise and regurgitate.

Nikw211

When I first saw this Tweet on this blog I smirked, with the sorry state of the contemporary arts in mind:


But now, I have just had to step away from Twitter in horror and disgust at the way people on Twitter are portraying the Catalan 'referendum' story.

As far as I can see, there are hundreds if not thousands of people wilfully misrepresenting a complex Constitutional issue in childishly simplistic terms of Darth Vader neoliberal storm troopers attempting to crush the plucky socialist rebels of Cataluña. And among those thousands are mainstream media outlets who you would hope would know better.

But apparently not.

The violence committed by the police has been really quite excessive as far as I can tell from the videos, photos and reports - but then we are talking about a region whose representatives have deliberately flouted the law, misappropriated government funds to print advertising for an illegal referendum and deliberately refused to follow directives from their government to prevent polling booths being set up.

Is it conceivable that any other nation would react any differently under the same circumstances?

What if Bavarian officials went through with an illegal secessionist Referendum from the rest of Germany, misappropriating government funds to do so? Or if Normandy did the same from the rest of France? Or California from the rest of the US? Or Cornwall from the UK?

What I apparently cannot get through to these people - mostly British people that is - who are demanding that Rajoy allow the vote to go ahead is that he cannot let the vote go ahead because it has been ruled unconstitutional. Rajoy is not above the law and he cannot simply look at the protests and say - 'Oh, well, they don't like that law so - the hell with it! Let them have their vote.'

Mainstream media keep reporting this as 'Madrid' having 'banned' the vote, thus dumping gasoline on the idea that Madrid is still in the grips of Francoist Fascism putting its boot on the neck of plucky socialist Barcelona and acting undemocratically - which is the most egregious bollocks, quite frankly.

The rule of law is as important as the right to vote - probably more so in many ways.

However passionately Catalans - certain of them at any rate - wish to be independent, they cannot simply seize it by main force, especially while pretending this is all being done in the name of democracy. Especially as, apparently, 59% of Catalans wish to remain part of Spain - at least according to one poll cited by the Financial Times.

Burnsie

What a finely-trained Leftist seal, she is. Hand her another fish.

One of the great "successes" of the Angry Studies movement is its ability to make sub-mediocre thinkers believe they're elite intellectuals. It's part of their recruitment success, I'm sure.

The young charges then learn a few buzzwords of the catechism and boom! It's off to the races with this kind of malarkey.

pst314

What a finely-trained Leftist seal, she is. Hand her another fish.

I don't mind most marine mammals, but I can do without sea lions:

http://wondermark.com/1k62/

pst314

Nikw2011: Thanks for posting that. I doubt that many people here in the United States know much about the issue, or its history. I certainly don't.

PiperPaul

"sub-mediocre thinkers believe they're elite intellectual"

A perfect example of the Dunning-Kruger effect, no?

Spiny Norman

pst314,

Clever.

(It's a pretty sad state of affairs that Malki has to post a 5 paragraph explanation of "metaphor".)

champ

Australia is finally getting around to addressing the really big issues...

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/blogs/tim-blair/words-are-hell/news-story/7dfc693980096724a75e13c214e9b917

jabrwok

they cannot simply seize it by main force

Well, they *can*, just not legally, and they can only do it if they can make it stick, which historically has required lots of guns and the willingness to use them.

I have no idea whether the Catalans seeking independence have the intestinal fortitude, or the munitions, needed to achieve their objective.

Given the on-going Islamic invasion of Europe, I'd think the natives would have more important things to worry about.

David

For anyone interested, the first three episodes of Star Trek: Discovery can currently be watched on YouTube here, here and here.

jones

"police arrested the woman, identified as 21-year-old Edith Macias, on suspicion of DUI and hit-and-run"

So when the good lady says "fuck your laws" I guess she means it?

One can hardly accuse her of being inconsistent then.

TimT

'Fuck your laws' lady actually does a toddler pout at 1.36 mins.

MC

Rajoy is not above the law and he cannot simply look at the protests and say - 'Oh, well, they don't like that law so - the hell with it! Let them have their vote.'

I can see how those riot police felt legally obliged to batter the hell out of the people trying to vote. If only they felt as strongly about the extremist Islamists in Catalonia.

Governments across the world ignore laws when it suits them. Rajoy could have allowed the referendum to take place but made it clear it was not constitutional and no more than a glorified poll. If the FT and other polls were right, the vote would be in favour of the status quo and undercut the independence demands.

I do not believe any nation has the right to deny independence to any part of itself, if a majority of the citizens demand it. Otherwise it is not behaving like a democracy but like an imperial power. The UK gave Scotland the opportunity to vote for independence, Scotland chose to remain part of the Union. This was all achieved without bloodshed.

R. Sherman

I do not believe any nation has the right to deny independence to any part of itself, if a majority of the citizens demand it.

That's a proposition which cannot be discussed in the U.S., simply because the issue is irretrievably tainted by Mid-Nineteenth Century U.S. history. Can you imagine the great wailing and gnashing of micro-aggressed teeth which would occur if such a question were posed in a Poli Sci class at an average university?

jones

MC,

"I do not believe any nation has the right to deny independence to any part of itself, if a majority of the citizens demand it."

I'll say at the outset that I really do not know what to think about the Catalan issue, in time I'll have a formulated opinion. My question with respect to your point though is at just what sub-division does one draw the line?

The county level? Town?

My teenage son would just love to secede from the union called the "Jones" family (as long as he can still have all the goodies of course).

I hope you can see my point.

R. Sherman

@Jones

Good question. As I intimated, the proposition is one worth discussing in all its ramifications. (BTW, I don't have an opinion about Catalan either. I know historically, they've chafed under Spanish rule, but the current situation is decidedly extra-constitutional.) Sadly, rational discussion is impossible in the U.S.--not because of any current, realistic threats of secession--but because of the historical baggage of succession.

Here's another question. What about where the "parent" wishes to secede from the "child?" In the U.S., we have any number of states which have taxed, spent and borrowed themselves into penury, all with the hope I'm sure of some sort of federal bailout. In other words, Illinois desires to conscript North Dakota (and the rest of all those 2016 "red" counties) to pay its debts. What about the rest of us saying to the "blue model" states and locations, "You're on your own. Via con Dios." In other words, who's seceding from whom?

Nikw211

@MC

I can see how those riot police felt legally obliged to batter the hell out of the people trying to vote.

Thanks for the clever-clever snark there, but please note I was quite clear in stating "The violence committed by the police has been really quite excessive".

Governments across the world ignore laws when it suits them.

So you're suggesting that Kim Jong-un of the DPRK is a fine example of a functioning government?

Great.

Also, incidentally, it was the Catalan authorities ignoring the Law that has done much to bring about this violence. This does not excuse the excessive use of force by the police, but it does need to be acknowledged how the police came to be there in such numbers in the first place.

Rajoy could have allowed the referendum to take place but made it clear it was not constitutional and no more than a glorified poll.

You don't need polling booths for "a glorified poll" nor do you need to invite every voter in the region to take part.

I do not believe any nation has the right to deny independence to any part of itself, if a majority of the citizens demand it.

I fully agree.

The UK gave Scotland the opportunity to vote for independence, Scotland chose to remain part of the Union. This was all achieved without bloodshed.

You will note, of course, that Scotland's vote was therefore legal and given a mandate by the UK parliament.

Things would have been quite different indeed if it had been discovered that Nicola Sturgeon and Alex Salmond had been siphoning off government funds to use to promote an illegal referendum vote and then - against an express ruling of the courts - proceeded to defy the courts and administer the vote illegally.

To see it from your point of view, one would have to consider Spain to be something like the popular rejection of authoritarian one-party Communist state rule by the peoples of Central and East Europeans in 1989/1990 - such a comparison is absurd.

Militant Trotskyite Paul Mason has already drawn an explicit comparison between Rajoy and Mubarak of Egypt - as if the government and nation of Spain is comparable to that of Egypt c. 2010-11.

The violence should be rightly condemned, but it is farcical to turn this into a story of an anti-democratic Fascist state - the more so when no major news outlet that I have seen so far has filmed let alone interviewed the Catalan citizens counter-demonstrating on the streets waving the Spanish, not the Catalan, flags.

jones

Nik,

What you said.

Also, I believe that the Pres of Catalan has just declared a UDI.

What interesting times we might shortly be living in. Juncker had better sober up sharpish.

MC

@Nikw211

Governments across the world ignore laws when it suits them.

So you're suggesting that Kim Jong-un of the DPRK is a fine example of a functioning government?

Strawman. I won't even bother...

Scotland's vote was therefore legal

The Catalan independence referendum could have been made legal. All the evidence seems to suggest that this would have resulted in a 'no' for independence, thus undercutting the nationalists. Just like in Scotland. Instead, Spain chose to treat Catalonia like a subject nation and to set heavy handed coppers on people who didn't like that.

Or Spain could have let the referendum go ahead but made it clear that it was illegal and that the result could not stand. It could then sue the separatists for the cost of the referendum and arrested them if they declared UDI.

I don't really care what Mason has to say about anything. I like cake. I am sure Stalin also liked cake; this does not delegitimise my fondness for a Victoria Sponge.

it is farcical to turn this into a story of an anti-democratic Fascist state

I am not claiming that Spain is a fascist state. However, states that don't use riot police to beat the crap out of peaceful protestors are less likely to be mistaken for fascist regimes.

To see it from your point of view, one would have to consider Spain to be something like the popular rejection of authoritarian one-party Communist state rule by the peoples of Central and East Europeans in 1989/1990 - such a comparison is absurd.

When you start a sentence with "to see it from your point of view" it is best to subsequently refer to my point of view, rather than what you imagine my point of view might be.

MC

@Jones - if a town or a village wished to secede, let it. But make it clear well in advance that secession means an end to the national systems that protect said town, the use of the national currency and the risk of increased electricity prices. Same argument would work for your son!

jones

"Same argument would work for your son!"

Yup, that would be my stance too but I'm not sure I'd win it......

The sooner I can send him down the mines to earn his stale-bread money the better. Or up chimneys, matters not.

WTP

UDI? Unidentified Drinking Inquiry?

https://www.internetslang.com/UDI-meaning-definition.asp

jones

WTP,

No, the definition of UDI is "Unidentified Drinking Injury".

It's the nightclub steps wot did it.

Daniel Ream

My teenage son would just love to secede from the union called the "Jones" family (as long as he can still have all the goodies of course).

Your son is Quebec?

jones

"Your son is Quebec?"

Does self-entitlement count?

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