David Thompson
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November 02, 2018

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Joan

Today's word is 'indoctrination'.

David

Today’s word is ‘indoctrination’.

“Educate yourself,” says the professor. By refusing even to listen to contrary points of view and slyly ensuring that others can’t. What’s telling, I think, is that this wasn’t some off-the-cuff comment, of a kind to which we’ve become accustomed, but a prepared document, typed up and printed, and then proudly handed out to students, as if none would object or regard it as juvenile. It was evidently something that the totally-grown-up state-funded educator thought proper and appropriate.

It’s quite a mindset, really. The assumption that this is the kind of thing one does.

And that one does and keeps one’s job.

PJH
"DeSoucey has since apologized for the handout..."

But not for having such views in the first place.

"Dr. DeSourcey reflected on her actions and realized she had crossed the line between educating and advocating"

I think there were a few more lines crossed after the advocacy one...

And the really worrying bit?:

However, some students did not find the incident too alarming.

(Twatter login still isn't working.)

David

(Twatter login still isn’t working.)

I reported the issue. I think the Typepad people may be preoccupied with the ‘http’ fiasco, still ongoing.

Thomas O

Trick question. These days I fully expect the answer is "both".

David

I think there were a few more lines crossed after the advocacy one...

Well, quite. Before and after. What’s striking is the mindset, the obliviousness - and the adolescent arrogance - that the letter implies. But as we’ve seen, repeatedly, more times than I can count, the distinction between a Clown Quarter professional and a chest-puffing adolescent is often rather slim.

Not a coincidence, I think.

Hector Drummond, Vile Novelist

Looks like some people haven't got the message that Fox News is turning centrist.

MC

However, some students did not find the incident too alarming.

Well, they chose to study sociology so that doesn't surprise me.

David

Well, they chose to study sociology so that doesn’t surprise me.

The field does seem to attract a very high concentration of dogmatic incompetents and outright loons.

Farnsworth M Muldoon

Pretentious teenager or sociology professor?

Embrace the power of "and". I can't help but notice that Miss DeSoucey took a whopping 14 years from freshman to getting a rubber stamp PhD, IOW, spent her entire adult life in angry and useless studies - it only takes 15 from freshman to board eligible neurosurgeon.

Basically, she is this punk girl, several years older, and still as confused.

David

Basically, she is this punk girl, several years older, and still as confused.

It occurs to me that when parents shied from threatening to smack their misbehaving children, despite repeated and appalling behaviour, and defaulted instead to negotiation and appeasement, it may have had some unhappy effects. The number of such bitches now roaming the Earth being one of them.

Presumably, the overindulged bint above, like so many others we’ve seen, is choosing to act in this way - and to go on acting this way, with an expectation of impunity - because nothing in life has taught her, vividly, that boundaries exist, and that, if violated repeatedly, someone might reciprocate.

Another Calgary Marc
...the distinction between a Clown Quarter professional and a chest-puffing adolescent is often rather slim.

Well, the thing is that the academics are eternal adolescents: Not Growing Up is in the job description.

David

(Twatter login still isn’t working.)

For anyone having trouble logging in via Twitter, I’ve been sent the following from Anna at Typepad:

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This is a public service announcement.

Daniel Ream

because nothing in life has taught her, vividly, that boundaries exist, and that, if violated repeatedly, someone might reciprocate.

So long as she remains safely ensconced within her academic ivory tower or a modern bourgeois urban evironment, no one will.

One of the things that concerns me greatly is the massive amount of action entertainment that shows petite women beating up male opponents twice their size with ease, increasingly without the aid of any kind of narrative fudge like superpowers. This has, I think, contributed to the disturbing increase in women using violence casually against each other and their intimate partners.

While I don't have any sympathy for anyone who uses casual violence to make a conversational point or as a substitute for proper emotional regulation, I'm worried that an entire generation of young women raised on Buffy the Vampire Slayer and roundhose-kicking cop chicks is eventually going to try this on with people insufficiently woke. At which point the Gods of the Copybook Headings physics and biology will once again have their say.

David

anyone who uses casual violence to make a conversational point or as a substitute for proper emotional regulation,

I recall Jordan Peterson and Camille Paglia chatting about the problem, for men, in dealing with demented and gratuitously aggressive women, and the hope that non-crazy women might somehow intervene. Of course, they were talking about civilised, bourgeois men, who generally have certain qualms and inhibitions, not Ms-13 savages or actual Muhammadan patriarchs. Who presumably favour more direct and emphatic approaches.

Darleen

sociology professor Michaela DeSoucey informed them that “every time Trump says ‘fake news’ he means ‘free press,’

No, he means Fake News; either by commission or omission.

Before going any further I want to take a moment to address the horrific shooting at the Tree of Life synagogue in Pittsburgh. It was terrible. Eleven Americans were brutally murdered in an evil anti-Semitic attack. Yesterday I traveled to Pittsburgh to meet with the families and first responders and I especially want to thank Rabbi Jeffrey Myers. He was terrific. He was terrific. Fine man. We grieve for the families of the fallen and we send our eternal gratitude to the law enforcement officers who sustained severe injuries taking down the gunman. They were incredibile. They were incredibile. They were incredibile. As bad as it was, it could have been far worse and they got there fast. We pledge our resolve to remove the vile poison of anti-Semitism and so many other problems from our world and we reaffirm our unbreakable solidarity with the Jewish people.

That was in the first five minutes. More of interest follows, including a comment or two about Israel, but I wanted to get that down for the record. The AP’s running account of Trump’s rally last night — posted here by the New York Times — somehow omits any mention of the remarks, as does the Times’s own account of the event by Katie Rogers.

Darleen

Fake News breathless over bombshells!!

David

Fake News breathless over bombshells!!

Heh. Captures the flavour, I think.

Darleen

Related -- just watched this whole interview (38 minutes) but what struck me most was the body language & facial expressions of the woman of the group. You know she hasn't really heard a thing Peterson says when she finally gets around to talking AT him about the 8 minute mark but the set-up is about at 6 minutes.

David

You know she hasn’t really heard a thing Peterson says when she finally gets around to talking AT him

If I were being unusually charitable, I might say that maybe some small part of it is a second-language issue; but yes, not listening, not repaying the courtesy, and instead talking at him, as if nothing had been said, and said repeatedly.

Sometimes, I really do marvel at his patience.

David

You know she hasn’t really heard a thing Peterson says when she finally gets around to talking AT him

I wonder if part of it - the not listening and the looks of something approaching a peeved bewilderment - is because the more of a middle-class lefty you are, the more pretending you tend to do, and the more likely it is that you’ll spend time sitting around with people who pretend almost exactly the same things, or fairly minor variations. The rules of this pretending, of piety, are mutually understood and perhaps a little too reflexive and habitual.

As I’ve said before, I think part of Peterson’s appeal is that he serves as a reminder that one doesn’t have to pretend.

Baceseras

David: ...the overindulged bint above ... is choosing to act in this way - and to go on acting this way, with an expectation of impunity - because nothing in life has taught her, vividly, that boundaries exist... 

Daniel: So long as she remains safely ensconced within her academic ivory tower or a modern bourgeois urban evironment... 

David, I watched the brief video clip, and all I can say is she's very young, and the goth semi-mask doesn't make it any easier to guess how she really feels about what she's doing, but I think I saw shades of expression, and heard notes in her speaking, that seemed to indicate an admission of self-doubt such as only a fundamentally good person can take to heart. If I venture a guess, she became somewhat uncomfortable with her own certainty; and knew it wasn't her chosen adversaries making her uncomfortable. And if she still kept hectoring them (for the short duration of that video), I'll put it down to pride, her not wanting to show self-doubt after rushing into battle. I can almost admire her for that, foolish as it is: there's a kinship in some kinds of folly.

In the end, though, wisdom is better.

Anyway, my point is she's too young for us to despair of -- she has lessons to learn (well who doesn't?), and time enough to learn them (devoutly hoped). In any case, it will always be wrong to look forward to the possibility of her getting a rough comeuppance, as if that were a good thing. I hope that wasn't what you and Daniel meant; I don't think you did, but it needs to be more clearly stated.

Everything she needs to learn is already in her -- even the spur to get going, that's in her too. No whupping needed. Agenbite of inwit is still a thing.

Farnsworth M Muldoon

...the goth semi-mask...

Watch again, there is noting "goth" about her, nor any discernible self-doubt. Lots of ignorance and conceit, though.

No whupping needed.

True, a beating like a Chinese gong would be more appropriate, but failing that, perhaps a trip to the slammer might help with an attitude adjustment.

Baceseras

Okay, I watched it again, now please nobody ask me for any more repeats. Damn but that's some embarrassing right there.

I still see goth origins to that makeup, though it may travel under some other name, or none. I still see self-doubt, or rather what I thought I had described above as the stirrings of self-doubt, plus the felt need to keep it from showing.

The choco-throwing was apparently unpremeditated. A bad impulse. There are supposed to be consequences; sometimes they fail to arrive; this time, they're here. But "the slammer"?! C'mon.

If I'm wrong and she feels no stirring of doubt, she should watch this video. Repeatedly.

Now, I'm not going to say jokes about beatings are inappropriate, but -- forgive me, Farnsworth -- they should be funnier.

Farnsworth M Muldoon

But "the slammer"?! C'mon.

Why ? She was arrested for battery, she deserves a trip to central booking and a stay in a cage till mummsy and daddy throw her bail, as they undoubtedly will.

Who was joking about beatings ? The whole trouble with these asshats is there are rarely real consequences, and a hickory shampoo or two judiciously applied, pour encourager les autres, as it were, will avoid setting the conditions for another Kent State in the future when her ilk run amuck, as is their wont.

Daniel Ream

But "the slammer"?! C'mon.

She's not going to f*ck you.

Baceseras

C'mon because a college student throwing chocolate milk on another college student in the course of a slanging match on the campus greensward is only "battery" in the most tightassed sense of the word. It's rude, it's crude, it's college. It shouldn't be, but it is. Her opponent was quite civil to her, before and after the incident. He didn't deserve the treatment he got from her -- but I bet he's gotten over it (the more so because his politics are conservative, and the conservative temperament that goes with that inclines to not blowing things out of proportion). You should get over it too. We all should. She should be ashamed of her behavior, and then she should get over it. Thirty years from now, when she's nominated for the Supreme Court, the matter won't be worth mentioning.

Baceseras

Who was joking about beatings ? The whole trouble with these asshats is... 

If you weren't joking when you said "beat her like a Chinese gong," you're the asshat.

David

If I venture a guess, she became somewhat uncomfortable with her own certainty… I’ll put it down to pride, her not wanting to show self-doubt after rushing into battle. I can almost admire her for that, foolish as it is: there’s a kinship in some kinds of folly.

You may well be right about the insecurity. I’ve known people who were aggressively dogmatic while betraying an inkling of their own difficulties with facts. I don’t see dogmatic narcissism, or what Peterson would call “ideological possession,” as being incompatible with an awareness that one is quite possibly full of shit. The two often coexist. They can dance. Generally, at some cost to others.

However, if someone presumes to bark opinions that they haven’t actually earned, but are regurgitating wholesale anyway, and to be angry and abusive for reasons they haven’t earned, and then, when politely challenged, they choose to become even more aggressive and start screeching abuse and throwing drinks on people, twice… well, this doesn’t strike me as a basis for admiration.

It’s also worth bearing in mind that the incident above isn’t some isolated aberration, but is part of a trend, almost a competition, whereby ideological bona fides and in-group status are won via aggressive, intimidating and loutish behaviour. As the campus environment and its default politics exacerbate such narcissistic theatre, even rewarding and congratulating it, prompt self-correction seems unlikely. And in the meantime, escalation is underway.

Again, conscientious parenting – imprinting the notion of reciprocation and boundaries, and what it can cost to violate them – might save a lot of bother later on.

[ Edited. ]

Farnsworth M Muldoon

You should get over it too. We all should. She should be ashamed of her behavior, and then she should get over it.

Yeah, let's all forget her and all her compatriots all over the country - scratch that, the formerly civilized world - acting like brats whenever they are confronted with an idea they don't like. A little milk here, sucker punching someone over a hat over there, a bike lock upside the head there, a Molotov cocktail there, just clean college kid fun. Oh how we laughed and laughed later as we roasted marshmallows over the burning limo.

True, the proper response would be for someone to have given her the backhand her parents never did, but you know damn well you would have been screaming "you can't hit a gurl" (even as she is punching you), and she would have been screaming for the rozzers, so yeah, a battery charge and a trip to the hoosegow is about the only alternative. Plus think of the upside, you can buy her book, "A Letter From The Tallahassee Jail".

If you actually think this dime store Che wannabe is ever going to be ashamed of her behavior and not lionized by her running buddies as a brave wymxn standing up to the "nazis", you really do live in Wolkenkuckucksheim, and what Daniel Ream said.

David

I can almost admire her for that, foolish as it is

Thing is, there is a pattern here. This isn’t about one obnoxious individual with impulse-control issues, operating in a vacuum, and who somehow happens to behave exactly like all the others, on dozens of campuses, with eerily similar assumptions and conceits.

Such vanities and behaviour are actively encouraged, and statusful, and therefore common, in her chosen environment. As we’ve seen countless times, in dozens of posts, ranging from gratuitously screaming at random strangers to breaking windows, running into traffic and actual rioting, these are the gestures that are expected of the woke. Recreational outrage is where it’s at. That’s how woke politics seduces the vain and credulous. It flatters them, relentlessly, and gives license to all manner of nasty little urges.

As I said in one the threads linked above, suppose for a moment that I were a malicious little shit and wanted to spend lots of time harassing people, vandalising their property, shoving them, scaring them, and mouthing racial abuse. In the real world, I’d run a definite risk of censure, social disapproval and possibly a good kicking. But if I were at a statusful university and invoked “social justice,” claiming that my behaviour was a reaction to some nebulous oppression and phantom “Nazis,” there’s a very good chance I’d be accommodated, even applauded. And for a certain kind of person, you can see the appeal.

But I’m not sure that’s something to be encouraged among our would-be intellectuals.

WTP

Let’s compromise. Can we all agree that her professors should be beaten like a Chinese gong?

WTP

Ooh... or better yet her administrators? If all elase fails I expect their football team to get beat like a Chinese gong come November 24.

David

Let’s compromise. Can we all agree that her professors should be beaten like a Chinese gong?

Heh. I believe sack beatings are the preferred form. One must observe the proprieties.

dw

Such vanities and behaviour are actively encouraged, and statusful... these are the gestures that are expected of the woke. Recreational outrage is where it’s at. That’s how woke politics seduces the vain and credulous. It flatters them, relentlessly, and gives license to all manner of nasty little urges.

That.

Hopp Singg

But "the slammer"?! C'mon.

Makes sense from a broken windows point of view, else the next woke thug would have to do her one better. As David points out, they're competitive about such things.

[Most like-minded groups, absent feedback, will drift to their more extreme position for just such reasons. This is doubly so where, as in this case, status anxiety is so heavily involved. Imho.]

Farnsworth M Muldoon

Heads up, could be a Moronolanche.

And remember that a lot of the good stuff at his site is in the comments.

True, true.

David

Heads up, could be a Moronolanche.

Watch your valuables. As of now, the toilets are out of bounds.

David

True, true.

It’s one of the things about this place that still pleases me. The comment threads actually work - much better than expected when I started doing this, eleven years ago - to the extent that the threads are often much more interesting than the posts.

R. Sherman

[Most like-minded groups, absent feedback, will drift to their more extreme position for just such reasons. This is doubly so where, as in this case, status anxiety is so heavily involved. Imho.]

That's precisely it. They must have scalps for honor at the camp fire. That's why they go on the warpath for the most trivial of reasons.

David

They must have scalps for honor at the camp fire. That’s why they go on the warpath for the most trivial of reasons.

It helps to bear in mind that the attitude we’re talking about can be summed up by this:

Fatuous, gratuitous and irretrievably narcissistic.

David

They must have scalps for honor at the camp fire. That’s why they go on the warpath for the most trivial of reasons.

If someone spends many of their formative years learning to value whininess and outrage - however contrived, self-indulgent or absurd - as denoting status, as validating their persona, then that’s very hard to undo (assuming any will to undo it). Especially if the outrage is competitive and peer-driven. If your supposed seriousness and radicalism hinge on being hysterically, even violently aggravated by the merest slight or demurral or ambiguity, anything but total, ongoing deference, that’s a hell of a mental habit to spend years cultivating. And it’s unlikely to be undone without some significant external cost.

Expulsion and jail time come to mind.

Farnsworth M Muldoon

Expulsion and jail time come to mind.

Beatings too, don't forget the beatings, or at least a sound thrashing, drubbing, or what for.

David

or at least a sound thrashing, drubbing, or what for.

In short, creating monsters is the easy part.

R. Sherman

Beatings too, don't forget the beatings, or at least a sound thrashing, drubbing, or what for.

It occurs to me that we see so many of these woke, SJW females engaging in these violent outbursts directed at conservative males, in which the males refuse to respond in kind. Perhaps, despite all the carping about "toxic masculinity," "internalized misogyny," not to mention "girrrrrl power," "magic vagina" and "female empowerment," they realize that conservative men are unlikely to give them the thrashing their behavior warrants, having rather internalized the mantra, "boys don't hit girls." (Contrast, of course, with the displays--roundhouse kicks and so forth--leftist men routinely direct at conservative women.)

So much for equality.

Farnsworth M Muldoon

It appears our Groucho eyebrowed commie lass did indeed spend the night in the Graybar Hotel.

She is also a volunteer for the nutcase running for governor, and a pro-"Palestinian" Jew. How that latter adds up is not entirely clear given they have killed a lot more of "her people" than the anti-Trump shooter in Philadelphia she was ululation about has.

Baceseras

Me - If I venture a guess, she became somewhat uncomfortable with her own certainty; and knew it wasn't her chosen adversaries making her uncomfortable. And if she still kept hectoring them (for the short duration of that video), I'll put it down to pride, her not wanting to show self-doubt after rushing into battle. I can almost admire her for that, foolish as it is: there's a kinship in some kinds of folly. 

David - You may well be right about the insecurity. I’ve known people who were aggressively dogmatic while betraying an inkling of their own difficulties with facts. I don’t see dogmatic narcissism ... as being incompatible with an awareness that one is quite possibly full of shit.

Yes, that's my point, David: plus the fact of her extreme youth; which taken together encourage me to believe there's ample time for her internal dynamic to resolve beneficially for her and the world around her.

David - However, if someone presumes to bark opinions that they haven’t actually earned, but are regurgitating wholesale anyway, and to be angry and abusive for reasons they haven’t earned, and then, when politely challenged, they choose to become even more aggressive and start screeching abuse and throwing drinks on people, twice… well, this doesn’t strike me as a basis for admiration.

True. What I can (almost) admire is her valor, not the silly cause she spent it on, and definitely not the yowling and splashery of her impulsive "assault." In fact I'm delighted she "chose" such ineffective tactics: perhaps fancifully, I wonder if she subconsciously prompted heself to futility of means, because deep down she saw the wrongness of her ends.

David - It’s also worth bearing in mind that the incident above isn’t some isolated aberration, but is part of a trend, almost a competition, whereby ideological bona fides and in-group status are won via aggressive, intimidating and loutish behaviour. As the campus environment and its default politics exacerbate such narcissistic theatre, even rewarding and congratulating it, prompt self-correction seems unlikely. And in the meantime, escalation is underway. 

I perfectly agree with you that it's part of a trend -- but it wouldn't be justice to punish this girl for a widespread social phenomenon; enough that she answer for her own lesser misdeed. "Prompt self-correction seems unlikely," as you say, but we didn't arrive at these parlous times all at once: any improvement we can manage will probably come just as gradually. Perseverance beats speed.

David - Again, conscientious parenting – imprinting the notion of reciprocation and boundaries, and what it can cost to violate them – might [have] save[d] a lot of bother later on 

F.T.F.Y. What might have been....

Farnsworth M Muldoon

What I can (almost) admire is her valor...

There is nothing valorous about having a hissy fit and attacking people you know won't fight back. You are, I am afraid, not a very serious person, and/or a hopeless Pollyanna.

WTP

While I don’t totally agree, I am sympathetic to Bacesaras’ point. Considering what makes young people who they are, I find it very difficult to heap the majority of the blame on such people themselves. As I said above only half-jokingly, it’s their parents, teachers, school administrators, and also the cesspool of our culture of the last 40-50 years, for which we are all to some degree resposible, that has created this mess. While I certainly do not wish to absolve her and her ilk of all responsibilities there is a lot of blame here.

Plus she’s a ‘Nole. Not a troupe to be taken too seriously. I keeeed, I keeeed.

JuliaM

Baceseras: "...encourage me to believe there's ample time for her internal dynamic to resolve beneficially for her and the world around her."

There's time, certainly. If only time was all it took.

Liz

our Groucho eyebrowed commie lass did indeed spend the night in the Graybar Hotel.

Why is there always a nose ring?

David

There’s time, certainly. If only time was all it took.

Well, quite.

Over the years, we’ve seen plenty of twenty-something and thirty-something woke-lings who left the campus cocoon, armed with degrees in perpetual outrage, and personalities to match, only to discover that the world doesn’t meet their expectations. As, for instance, here, where a sworn enemy of conservatives, bourgeois values and “heteropatriarchal crap” is still struggling to process why her life is a mess, and who she can blame for it.

Of course, no-one wants to think of themselves as a sucker, a victim of their own vanities, and it’s easier on the ego to blame capitalism or racism or “toxic masculinity,” rather than reflect on the idiocy and arrogance of their own choices. And so, we find lots of resentful, self-pitying articles, published in Salon, or Mic or Everyday Feminism, all professing victimhood and denying their own responsibility for spending money they didn’t have and will never repay on an education of negative value, and insisting that the world should want to employ self-declared “political troublemakers” and another five thousand haughty denouncers of “neoliberal patriarchy.”

Oh, and self-described “multi-dimensional creatives” who want to “bring awareness to social justice issues.”

Farnsworth M Muldoon

... I find it very difficult to heap the majority of the blame on such people themselves.

I don't, they are a very loud and obnoxious minority of people their age, but a minority nonetheless. There are some 40,000 students at FSU many of whom have had crappy parents, and most of whom have had the same crappy teachers, school administrators, and cesspool of our culture of the last 40-50 years, yet most of them are studying or partying.

Wait, it is FSU, partying and studying, still she is the only one who has managed to make it to the international news by being an uncivilized brat.

Why is there always a nose ring?

Part of the uniform. Per the Law of Land Warfare, to be considered a lawful enemy combatant one must, among other things, have a "...fixed distinctive sign recognizable at a distance...", brightly colored hair works better, but Groucho Brows™ and nose rings also count.

WTP

Wait, it is FSU, partying and studying, still she is the only one who has managed to make it to the international news by being an uncivilized brat.

True. But she’s the one you are hearing. There are many more who stand by her madness if not necessarily her methods. Talk to many people under 40 or even older. Half of this country (or more precisely this country’s representatives) were perfectly willing to believe completely fabricated, totally unfounded rape accusations against a well respected SCOTUS nominee. Many for the very “reasons” this young lady is going ape sh*t.

WTP

Forgot to include, totally unfounded rape accusations FROM OVER THIRTY YEARS AGO. Sigh...

Farnsworth M Muldoon

Talk to many people under 40 or even older. Half of this country (or more precisely this country’s representatives) were perfectly willing to believe completely fabricated, totally unfounded rape accusations...

A couple of points, first, it depends on where one talks to the under 40ish. Correct me if I am wrong, but you are somewhere in or from Florida, and what you will hear from someone on the I-95 side south of Jupiter is going to be way different than from someone on the I-10 corridor west of Tallahassee. That is not intended to be a diss on Florida, just and observation based on my having to travel to these places from time to time, I could say the same about my corner of South Flyoverlandia and our City of Shame™, or Texas and Pyongyang on the Colorado.

Next, I don't believe, well except maybe for Pelosi who isn't in our universe anymore, that any politician actually believed the Kavanaugh accusations so much as grabbed them for their own cynical purposes such as getting their faces on the tube.

WTP

A couple of points, first, it depends on where one talks to the under 40ish. Correct me if I am wrong, but you are somewhere in or from Florida,

Yep. Smack dab in the middle. Orlando area. And I’m talking about 40 year olds and such with real jobs. Engineers, software developers, many working at defense contractors like Lockheed-Martin. As for “I-10 west of Tally”, have you ever driven I-10, especially west of Tally? The most boring stretch of interstate east of the Mississippi, excepting maybe I-16. And US 19 along the big bend out to Panama City or such is even more desolate. Nothing but trees. For miles and miles. Trees don’t vote.

And it matters zilch whether or not the politicians believed that crap, they wanted to get on teevee to show their constituents, you know, voters, that they believed it.

WTP

Sorry...that would be US 98, not 19. Been a while.

Farnsworth M Muldoon

As for “I-10 west of Tally”, have you ever driven I-10, especially west of Tally?

Frequently, but I guess I wasn't clear enough, by "corridor" - I meant the slice between the Alabama border and the Gulf which rolls up Pensacola, Ft. Walton, Destin, Panama City, etc. all of which heavily red voter places, as opposed to the blue voter transplants in South Brooklyn over on the I-95 side.

pst314

Well, they chose to study sociology so that doesn’t surprise me.
The field does seem to attract a very high concentration of dogmatic incompetents and outright loons.

And these loons have been working hard to exclude people who are not radical leftists.

Baceseras

Me - ...ample time ... for her and the world around her 

JuliaM - ...certainly. If only time was all it took.

--Well may the sweet Almighty God look down on us with compassion! Do you realize that at your age Mose Art had written four symphonies and any God's amount of lovely songs? Pagan Neeny had given a recital on the fiddle before the King of Prussia and John the Baptist was stranded in the desert with damn the thing to eat only locusts and wild honey. Have you no shame man?

--Well, I'm young yet.

--Is that a fact now? You are like the rest of them, you are counting from the wrong end.

__________________
(Flann O'Brien, The Hard Life)

Baceseras

Farnsworth - ...and what Daniel Ream said 

Fla slammer has conjugal visits?! This is great country!

Farnsworth M Muldoon

Fla slammer has conjugal visits?!

They might, but I am guessing you missed that whole part about how she is not going to do you, so it is, even in your case as the apparent president of her fan club, a moot point.

Ten

There are some 40,000 students at FSU many of whom have had crappy parents, and most of whom have had the same crappy teachers, school administrators, and cesspool of our culture of the last 40-50 years...

There are a good fifteen FSUs in this dump we've made for ourselves.

"The modern man is no longer a unity, but a confused bundle of complexes and nerves." — Fulton J. Sheen

https://twitter.com/wrathofgnon/status/882398661145018368

Baceseras

Farnsworth -... I am guessing you missed that whole part ... 

That "part" was the whole thing, so of course I didn't miss it, how could I? 

Daniel Ream

plus the fact of her extreme youth

Extreme youth?

She's 19. Old enough to drink[1], vote, and die for her country. Old enough to be held completely legally responsible for assaulting another human being.

She's not a child, she's not a naif, and she's still not going to f*ck you.

As a aside, when I was in university there was a toy company that made water shotguns - pumping them charged a pressure chamber, and pulling the trigger blasted the contents of the barrel in one solid slug of water. Only good to about ten feet, but within ten feet you were going to get soaked to the skin.

We discovered very quickly that if you loaded them with grocery-store white vinegar and aimed for the face, you could incapacitate someone for several minutes without technically crossing the line into administering a noxious substance. This came in handy more than once when drunken engineering students decided to roust a campus event.

I cannot help but think that something similar would be in order for incidents such as these.


[1] In Canada anyway, I understand the Yanks insist on pretending college students won't drink until the age of 21 or summat

Baceseras

Hello, Daniel -- good point about legal responsibility. I agree completely. As for "assaulting another human being," that phrase is a little high-flown in this case. She splashed chocolate milk on him. Intentionally, and with malicious intent, let the record show. While "hurling execrations," as the bad old translation of Camus we used in high school used to say. She should pay a fine, and her victim's dry-cleaning bill -- or, at his option, replace the item with top-end goods of the same kind. And that I think should completely cover her legal responsibility.

You maybe wish the Law in its Majesty would crush her -- because Professor Bikechain got off with a slap on the wrist, or because she's a symbol of What's Wrong with Everything Nowadays, or because it's Time to Show We Mean Business. But no, just no. Justice requires her to pay no more than she owes.

Farnsworth M Muldoon

And that I think should completely cover her legal responsibility...Justice requires her to pay no more than she owes.

What you "think" is completely irrelevant, fortunately saner minds in the State of Florida get to decide what constitutes battery and what the penalties are, and for simple battery that would be 1 year in jail and a $1000 fine.

...or because it's Time to Show We Mean Business...

Why not ? She is the way she is because of legions of mollycoddling people like you who for years have offered up flaccid excuses such as your, "extreme youth", "it was only milk", nonsense for this type of behavior.

The $64 question is why you are so hard over on making excuses for this clown who will only become more FUBAR without some serious disciplinary action.

Chester Draws

Can't say I think throwing milk at someone is really battery. There's a certain requirement that one might be battered IMO.

If we always jailed people for that, then our jails would be full.

I've suffered more damage getting a drink at a bar.

David

I perfectly agree with you that it’s part of a trend -- but it wouldn’t be justice to punish this girl for a widespread social phenomenon; enough that she answer for her own lesser misdeed.

I haven’t seriously suggested otherwise. My point is that the wider trend and the attendant air of impunity may explain why the people having drinks thrown on them, or having their property stolen or destroyed - often by self-styled ‘activists’ who video their own delinquency and upload it to impress their peers - are turning to the law. Perhaps they’ve seen too many examples of woke aggression going unpunished, or being applauded by campus staff, to let smaller incidents pass without legal sanction.

If the drink-throwing incident were a random one-off, unrelated to a wider and escalating context, the response to it, involving the police, might seem disproportionate, or more effort than strictly necessary. But… there is a context, and a concern that normal, less dramatic corrective procedures are not being used as one might wish.

[ Added: ]

In short, when left-leaning campus administrators and educators tolerate and excuse, and even encourage, aggression, vandalism and antisocial behaviour by leftist students, to a point where it’s routine, it’s hardly surprising that the targets of such behaviour search out other avenues of reply.

Baceseras

Daniel - fortunately saner minds 

That be my prayer.

WTP

Can't say I think throwing milk at someone is really battery. There's a certain requirement that one might be battered IMO.

If we always jailed people for that, then our jails would be full.

Or beer. Hockey season is coming. This is giving me flashbacks. When I was in collage, following a particularly frustrating loss to Half Ass U, in a moment of clowning around, my dorm’s resident assistant made some stupid remark and I playfully threw a handfull of ice at him. Clearly in jest, not hard at all. Snowflake boy didn’t like my disrespecting of his au-THOR-it-tay. Wrote me and my buddy up. We had to appear before the conduct board where with all seriousness they leveraged the full legal threat of hitting me with assault charges. Now that I’ve had some time to reflect on that, I say throw the bok at her.

WTP

Or the book. Whatever works.

WTP

And college not collage. Preview is my friend...preview is my friend...

Farnsworth M Muldoon

If we always jailed people for that, then our jails would be full.

To be fair, yours are filled with mean tweeters and bozos who flip off speed cameras, so a stint in the calabaloose for Miss Karlina Mark isn't disproportionate for her antics.

Ten

What you "think" is completely irrelevant, fortunately saner minds in the State of Florida get to decide what constitutes battery and what the penalties are, and for simple battery that would be 1 year in jail and a $1000 fine.

She is the way she is because of legions of mollycoddling people like you...

Chocolate milk? Why, with a dozen of its finer "minds", the People shall now shovel another thirty thousand public dollars to the commercial prison complex to wreck a childish moron, thereby demonstrating their character and resolve and that of their considerable renaissance of principle.

This is the reactionary Law'n Order Republicanism that, having given away a nation in a century of intractable apathy, shall restore it one political victim at a time by flailing anger and bias at specific phantoms.

Here's one: She is the way she is because of legions of slothful "saner minds" still haven't rethought public academe, corporate media, the all-invasive State, instinctive partisan reactionism, and their preferred subject status.

What, rediscover original structuralism? Character and resolve?

If it weren't for a slightly orange, completely random candidate-of-happenstance that so-called "saner" right might still be taking its socio-political cues from the left, picking its diminished cultural tropes and habits up off the street, squandering its formative traditions, organizations, and structures, and arguing for its own lovely statism.

She is the way she is just as possibly because the right barely has the first clue what it's doing.

David

She is the way she is just as possibly because the right barely has the first clue what it’s doing.

That too.

Ten

If we always jailed people for that, then our jails would be full.

https://s1.ibtimes.com/sites/www.ibtimes.com/files/styles/embed/public/2014/03/19/prisoners2-01.png

Farnsworth M Muldoon

What, rediscover original structuralism? Character and resolve?...She is the way she is just as possibly because the right barely has the first clue what it's doing....If we always jailed people for that, then our jails would be full.

Oh good, now we are going to fall back on chicken and egg arguments as to why this clown shouldn't be punished.

Character and resolve, or even good table manners, don't just magically appear in a person, they are taught through a system of reward and punishment starting as soon as a sprog leaves the factory. That the right has abrogated a lot of responsibility doesn't absolve the left of its insipid approach to dealing with offenders. That jails are "full" (a dubious argument at best) is a result of a) a failure to instill character instead of crap like "self esteem" in young heathens; b) declaring anything other than lying around on your rack and lifting weights in prison "cruel and unusual" punishment; c) not allowing alternate sentencing - put an ankle monitor on this twit and make her report to a chain gang picking up litter on I-10.

I ask again, what is the fascination with this little brat that she shouldn't be proverbially pounded into the ground like a tent peg ? Everybody here knows, regardless of how cliche it might sound, that if a white male campus Republican had a public snit fit throwing milk and kicking over Campus Commie Committee Placards that it would have been on the news for a week, he would have been expelled, and under the Leon County jail.

Before anyone says it, no I am not singling her out, the same should apply (or have applied) to the likes of Professor Bikelock, Miss Felarca, Moldylocks, and we can go all the way back to Bill "Guilty as sin, free as a bird" Ayers. The answer is not, as some here appear to believe, to continue to let people skate because others in the past have.

Ten

Everybody sees that you're indignant, Muldoon, and that the consequences shall be dire, but the loft of the associated thundering about tent pegs and chain gangs may be somewhat dampened by particular insights on penalties, justice, and 12 peers.

And systems too, because while a sniffing disgust should never be blunted, the US really does thoroughly lead the civilized and uncivilized worlds in parties rendered for behavioral reform.

The system is working so well it's not much working at all. Republicans despising statism like they do I just thought that warranted spelling out.

Anyway, they're broadcasting something and I can't miss it. Have you seen what you can get a 60' display for these days?

Sam

Great, as if having our worst football season since the Reagan administration wasn't embarrassing enough.

[hangs head in shame and slowly shambles into hole to die]

Hopp Singg

Is there any part of the thrown-drink debate that a sentence of "5 public belts on the backside" wouldn't solve?

Farnsworth M Muldoon

Is there any part of the thrown-drink debate that a sentence of "5 public belts on the backside" wouldn't solve?

Probably not, but the same applied privately by her parents probably would have prevented it, as abhorrent as even that would have been to her fan club here (BTW, she is not going to screw you either, Ten).

Piedro

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/nov/03/roma-tire-shouldering-blame-boiling-pot-communities

“We’ve lived here 35, 40 years and you expect us to sit silently,” said another, claiming that he had 60 cousins ready to provide back-up for what he said could be “a riot like you’ve never seen before in your life”

Sixty cousins. Pretty sure he doesn't get chocolate milk thrown on him.

David

Sixty cousins.

Ah, another triumph of multiculturalism. And just down the road from where I grew up.

R. Sherman

Just a couple of points regarding our SJW heroine's night in jail. Undoubtedly, that occurred because she either could not or would not post a bond to guarantee her attendance at any subsequent legal proceedings, not as punishment for the alleged crime. In my jurisdiction, the maximum bond for a misdemeanor is $500.00, which can be posted by laying down 10% cash. Something like this is normally resolved by having someone sign a summons promising to appear. My guess is this chick decided to spend the night in jail to burnish her SJW credentials, so she refused to sign a summons or "Recog" bond and probably treated the police like shit in the bargain.

Second, such incidents rarely, if ever, result in incarceration upon conviction. Absent the defendant being a recidivist drink thrower, a first conviction would result in probation or at worst, a fine. Yes, the maximum penalty for a misdemeanor is up to an $X dollar fine, or up to 1 year in the county lock-up or a combination or fine and incarceration, but the maximums are rarely, if ever, imposed for common assaults. If there is significant injuries involved, i.e. a punch thrown, prosecutors will upgrade the charge to a felony.

Bottom line, we can un-bunch our panties. This chick is not being mistreated.

Ten

(BTW, she is not going to screw you either, Ten).

Yes, there is that striking, resonant continuity - that continuous existential thread - between philosophizing about the descent of Western Civilization through the undermining of its institutions and the commensurate sloth of the traditionalists where renewing it is concerned on the one hand, and randomly banging a misfit deconstructionist radical - the obvious epigenetic progeny of similar parents, we're assured - ten years younger than our own daughters because something-something on the other.

I'm reconsidering everything right now.

Ten

...incidentally, Muldoon, as roundly entertaining as the image is, it's also the sort of thing that could have a guy finding the right, as I may have put it, out picking its diminished cultural tropes and habits up off the street.

Farnsworth M Muldoon

Speaking of tropes...

If it weren't for a slightly orange, completely random candidate-of-happenstance...

The "orange man bad" shtick is a bit tired, you might want to try something original.

This chick is not being mistreated.

So that means Baceseras no longer has to console her and Ten doesn't get to let everyone out of the slammer ?

The solution for a lot of this nonsense would be a civilian version of the UCMJ and NJP.

Ten

The "orange man bad" shtick is a bit tired, you might want to try something original.

Bad, Internets lingoist?

So that means Baceseras no longer has to console her and Ten doesn't get to let everyone out of the slammer ?

Only with your permission, sir, including when you make shit up, sir.

a civilian version of the UCMJ and NJP.

Or China's national personal merits system.

You know, I only mentioned a big flaming hoop, Muldoon, I didn't tell anyone to go racing through it.

David

[ Fetches box of two dozen small, slightly damp kitchen sponges. ]

In case you want to throw things at each other.

Hey, I like to look after my patrons.

Ten

This chick is not being mistreated.

Before Muldoon goes off again, nobody cares. At issue is the gulf between rightist rhetorical revenge porn and actual conservative restoration. Obviously the latter obsoletes the former.

And vice versa, come to think of it.

Ten

I'll stop, David. My notion was always stillborn.

Farnsworth M Muldoon

a civilian version of the UCMJ and NJP.

Or China's national personal merits system.

"What are two things that are completely unlike each other, Alex ?"

Before Muldoon goes off again, nobody cares.

Obviously you care, or else you wouldn't be so cheesed that she might actually be punished, probably for the first time in her life.

At issue is the gulf between rightist rhetorical revenge porn and actual conservative restoration.

Oh my, "revenge porn". Hyperbole, it is not just for breakfast anymore, and why would you care about "conservative restoration" given that it is obvious you have as much "conservative" bent as FDR ?

Baceseras

No peeking

Duck!

Ten

Permission to correct Muldoon again, Host?

"What are two things that are completely unlike each other, Alex ?"

I'll take that double Internets lingo-snarky-fu to mean you're still hollering squirrel and pointing. (Just spotted you one back; you're welcome.)

Your third slogan is naturally then that Orwellianism is always actually landing on Europe and not your militarized civilian codes of mass conduct and a presumably tribunal justice system. Because.

Obviously you care, or else you wouldn't be so cheesed that she might actually be punished, probably for the first time in her life.

Punishment. Not so much, Major Fallacist. Also, lying in the rational world includes projecting to pretend to misunderstand a point you can't reason around.

Oh my, "revenge porn". Hyperbole, it is not just for breakfast anymore, and why would you care about "conservative restoration" given that it is obvious you have as much "conservative" bent as FDR ?

By extension, we're to believe that the pounded tent pegs and highway litter chain gangs upthread was actually figurative but now because argle-bargle there's this connection between your latest interlocutor and the Great Society just like there was between him and banging nitwit SJW chicks.

Because Muldoon. Just establishing terms, your marvelous flanneled dimwit you, not that you weren't doing a fabulous job yourself.

David

Permission to correct Muldoon again, Host?

Don’t mind me. I’m scarfing raspberries and Greek yoghurt.

[ Slides box of sponges closer. ]

Sam

I’m scarfing raspberries and Greek yoghurt

Phrasing, dear host.

David

Phrasing, dear host.

Heh. I had to visit the Urban Dictionary to see what you meant. Ahem. To clarify, I was eating said items in a hasty way, with no regard for social propriety. Not… the other thing.

Daniel Ream

In case you want to throw things at each other.

[pumps water shotgun with an ominous ka-chunk]

Thanks, I'm good.

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